ReminiscencesDo you remember?. . . . . .. . Do you have any old photos?
|
Please email your reminiscences for adding to this page.
|
'Green Street Green' by The New Vaudeville Band, recorded in 1967. Apparently the band members were on their way to a gig in Hastings. As they passed through the village, they thought it would make a good title for a song. Unfortunately it was not a hit, although it was played on the pirate station Radio London. Radio 2 DJ Brian Matthew played it a few times on his radio show.
Listen to the track on YouTube.
Contributed by Brian Burgess
Click on image to enlarge
Listen to the track on YouTube.
Contributed by Brian Burgess
Click on image to enlarge
N.ick Venters.now lives in Bundaberg, Queensland. Australia but grew up in Green Street Green in the 1940s and 1950s
"I have lived in Australia and Papua New Guinea since 1963. My memories are boyhood only and that, living where we did, we were betwixt and between Green Street Green (GSG) and Chelsfield. So, my recollections are slightly broader ranging rather than GSG specifically.
I was born in June 1942, in a house named “Braemar”, in Tubbenden Lane, near Orpington Station. Six months later, our family moved to Holly Cottage, Holly Road in Green Street Green. We remained there until I was 19. Holly Road then was a solid bog in winter and a grassland in summer. Many times I winter we got tuck in gluey ruts in our old Singer car. There was only gaslight and no phone nor electricity until much later. There were only three houses in the road and we had nearly an acre of garden, with wonderful open countryside across the fence and the A21 valley to Norstead Manor.
We thought the GSG farmer who farmed the fields outside our garden was named Mr Holly. Perhaps someone can confirm that, as I would be interested in knowing what it really was. His Guernsey dairy cows grazed over the fence. I remember his farm men spreading muck from horse carts, hand sowing wheat seed, the old threshing machine and gang, straw ricks and even, once, a gang hand tedding and raking the hay. All in the field over the garden fence were the final throws of the old farming systems. Even at this young age, they always let me help. And I did with all those jobs. (I followed agriculture in later life). We understood that the fence at the end of the “tree” roads right down to GSG was the London Green Belt boundary but I see from Google that our old garden has been extended out into that field.
Also, from that field, we could see the fighter planes land/take off at Biggin Hill. Then the first of the new jets – the Meteors arrived. The world was about to change. At the end of Holly Road an air raid siren stood for some years. Evidently a barrage balloon was also in the field close by. I am told the last doodlebug exploded near Chelsfield. Perhaps that is the one for which I remember being rushed down to our garden air raid shelter. Yet, for all we now know about the 1950s Cold War, it utterly passed us by. Nothing mentioned in school.
At the junction of Holly Road and Worlds End Lane (WEL) was a large house with large chestnut trees and the garden ran almost the entire length of one side of Holly Road. An elderly, cultured couple, Mr & Mrs Saunders, lived here. I believe they were senior members of the Alpine Garden Society. Many times their visitors in large pre-war cars with huge headlights would park outside their house.
Also always parked at this end of Holly Road was the poor old Express Dairies horse, nose bag on, resting after pulling the heavy milk cart all the way from the Orpington depot and all the way up WEL hill. A vision held deep all my life, which has affected my views on animal treatment, is of one of those horses desperately trying to pull that cart around the corner of WEL into Glentrammon Road – very steep here – on Ice! It nearly died from its efforts. Electric carts were a blessing.
Coming out of Holly Road onto WEL, to the right was the more gentrified area of Homestead and Oxenden Wood Roads and the “other” end of the Lane.
Almost opposite, was Julian Road. Mr Wells the builder lived in the first house. I remember the new sewage line being put in right down the centre of this hard, white chalk/flint unmade road - old steam type excavators digging very deep trenches. This was the beginning of post war modernisation. One walk down Julian Road to get to Chelsfield Station, via Windsor Drive. There were no houses in Windsor Drive in those days just wheat fields. Several times, big fires rage through them, lit by embers thrown out of the funnels of speeding steam trains. In the early 50s, I remember waiting for the train to school, about 8.30 am, with the magnificent sight and sound of the Golden Arrow or the French Pullman Overnight Paris to London Express roaring through the station, Pullman table lamps glowing. Now, all trains are doing 100mph..
Windsor Drive then, in snow times, was a magnet for schoolboy tobogganers like me, as was the steep hillside above GSG between Old Hill and the bypass. There were large numbers of lads at these times.
Turning left from Holly was the very steep hill down to GSG and a more mixed population. Three ’tree’ ’roads down, on the corner of Elm Road was Mr Black’s grocery shop, for whom I worked, aged 15, as a Saturday delivery boy, huge loads of grocery orders tottering on the back and front carriers of a very heavy black delivery bike (a la Granville in “Open all Hours”!). I always went up the hill as far as Oxenden and sometimes down the really steep, slippery “Squirrels Path” down to the A21 and along to The Hillside with deliveries. Do kids do this nowadays? I earned 7/6d (37.5p) plus tips! Of course this would go straight back to Mr Black for Wagonwheels (much bigger then) and a bottle of Tizer or Lucozade.
The next road down was Ash. At its corner was the Post Office Shop. I could never work out why GSG PO was right up here. I can’t remember another one right in the village. Along this road lived an eccentric elderly lady, Mrs Cutler. Much caution was shown by small boys from the waving walking stick.
At the next corner down was the Anglican Church and Hall. My mother was a member of the Chelsfield Choral and Orchestral Society. One memorable Christmas, they performed Handel’s ‘’Messiah’’ in the hall. They did well, with a great sound.
A few yards further down, was (and still is) the upper end of the Public Footpath that came up from the village and had a pongy beginning alongside the farm. Next down, were the semidetached farm workers cottages. And so on, down past Vine Road School to the very bottom with the Queen’s Head on one side and 4 shops on the other. The first was the Barber shop, with railings outside, good for kids to somersault on. The last was a real Fish Shop that my mother often went to.
Directly across the main street was an old, narrow, two-storey timber building, to me much in the old Kentish style. It was occupied by a WW veteran with a bad leg (possibly polio), who ran it as a cobblers. A fine smell of leather emanated from the shop. We went there quite often until my father started mending our school shoes himself. They had all leather soles in those days.
Next door was Mrs Tullet’s - what a great sweet and tobacco shop that was. Off the bus from school in Orpington, we ran straight across the road into Mrs Tullet’s for a sherbet or liquorice, something to propel us up that hill, home.
Going to school, we waited at the bus stop under those huge horse chestnut trees opposite The Queen’s Head for the little green 471 bus. They had good conkers in season. Now they are gone since the ‘87 storm. What a pity - they were a village feature.
At the other end of the High Street was Well’s Newsagency, with Wall’s ice cream. Their son was a school mate and would be the same age as I am. Next to it was an ironmongers. How I wish they were still around. The shop men in long brown work coats; paper bags, nails loose and by the penny, hurricane lamps... So much in so small a place. Certainly nothing plastic!
Back toward the Queen’s Head was Mr Dawes’ Bike Shop. My first bike came from there - a beaut maroon BSA. Ah, still I can smell the aroma of a bike shop – Mr Dawes well remembered.
Was there a Co-Op? (The Co-Op in Windsor Drive had one of those overhead wires, spring driven money pots crisscrossing the shop.) I do remember the butcher and watching the huge heavy sides of beef, covered in white cheese cloth, being unloaded and carried over the shoulder into the shop. There was always clean sawdust on the floors. A greengrocer and an off-licence were in that shop row, too (and were still there in the 90s but not now). The rest is hazy.
Opposite Well’s was the old Brewery. In memory I always thought of it as a Morphy Richards place during my years. Or was it a Telephone company? (It was Telcon Plastics from before WWII until 1970/80s). Round towards Farnborough Hill was an old complex of buildings that the Circus used. But also, a Motor Mechanic. My parents took their old Singer car there a few times. (It has been a bus garage for many years now).
In the junction between Farnborough Hill and the by-pass was Brodies Garage and Coaches. Their son Ian went to our school. I believe this business was later bought by the Lewis family. They moved into a house opposite ours in Holly Road, mid 50s.
Strong in the village then was TocH, instigators, I think, of your present Village Centre building? (Indeed they were!) Dad was a member and I remember Mr Ivan Taylor of Oak Road, Dr Forster of Glentrammon Road and another gentleman who was a retired teacher and lived at the farm end of the village main street.
The identity my mother always ensured we raised our school caps to, was Nurse Carriage, the Midwife (was that her correct name?). I’m not sure if she attended my, or my brother’s home birth, but my mother had some respect for her. She would always be with her bike and in uniform, up and down WEL hill. The energy and dedication she showed - I think she had a car in later times.
The double decker, red, London Transport no.51 buses used to terminate in GSG at this end of the village, in an area next to the roundabout between the main street and the by-pass, where we’d collect the bus numbers, across from the Royal Oak. This pub leaned toward the more well-heeled, sports car group. Nearby, the bottom of Old Hill was an old Roman road – a schoolboy myth?
Also, then, the LT Greenline long distance, both single and double decker green buses came through GSG. They came down through Bromley I think and went through to Tonbridge. It was quite exciting to ride on them – “express”! I never did get to do the Orpington Station, GSG, Cudham, Knockholt full round trip on the little green 471 buses. These iconic little buses were made especially for London Transport’s more outlying country lane routes. This one was based in their Dunton Green garage. Cudham is still a mystery to me. Now, I believe you have many buses going everywhere.
A mile or so along the A21 towards Pratts Bottom, down below Holly Road, the Orpington Council garbage trucks would tip the refuse into what must have been old road making gravel pits on the Cudham side of the A21 What an archaeological dig it would make! A big mystery to me still, always interested in geography, is that GSG lies in a valley, often high sided, that runs all the way from Badgers Mount to Orpington. Yet there is no sign of a watercourse or stream or of piping under the roads to take away heavy rain water. Where DOES it all go? In the booklet “The History of GSG” no mention is made. Perhaps it filled the old village pond, now the roundabout. Where also, did the old Brewery water come from?
In one of the woods towards Pratts Bottom is a chalk cave. We boys always called it a “Highwayman’s hideout” but what was it?
The only way between GSG and Chelsfield was either up and along the steep Worlds End Lane and then Church Lane or, back to Warren Road. An even longer route. I do not think that Vine Road and Windsor Drive were really connected when I was a boy. If so, it was rugged. Mostly it was rough and flinty. Glentrammon Road was a shocker and Woodlands Road a bog and rutted. So, I don’t think GSG people made much use of Chelsfield Station. GSG being in a valley, the only way to get anywhere was UP! Holly Road, being mid-way, we used the station quite a lot.
Several times, we caught the train to Dunton Green and then changed to the little branch line that took us to General Wolfe’s village of Westerham. Then we took Public Footpath walks towards Ide Hill, Chartwell and so on, through beautiful north Kent countryside. Returning from one of those trips through Polhill Tunnel, I am still convinced that I saw lights and men in an offshoot tunnel. A “secret” war time tunnel going under to the Halstead Research complex - Fort Halstead?
Also, in the 50s, through GSG in summer time, came great “herds” of cyclists. All coming out of London to spend the weekends in the Kent countryside and even as far as the coast. Returning, they had huge blue bunches of bluebells strapped and wilting on the backs of their bikes. I remember big groups of riders outside the pubs, cafes – and Mr Dawes’ bike shop!
Later in the 50s, when modern motor bikes became prevalent, large groups of lads came through GSG on their new shiny, swept back wind shielded machines. The old push bike had had its day. Most of these motor bike brand names now are also in memory only.
GSG was a bit fortunate to have the by-pass. En masse car trips really took off in the 50s summer times. The constant roar of them returning back to London on a Sunday evening would carry up to us in Holly Road from the A21 below. Many of the cars in those days would break down from overheating. after the slow crawl up Polhill and especially Riverhill. The old cars would be dotted along the A21, bonnets up, steam escaping.
Towards Orpington, before Warren Road, was a hillside of shrubby hawthorns and so on - several acres, in the middle of which was the “Scout Hut” where, for a short time I went to Cubs. There was a large, unused, concrete swimming pool where you could catch newts. What was this place? A pre-war sports club? An Army unit? Now, I think it is part of Osbourne Avenue and is completely covered in housing. When a boy, it was quite a wild area.
I went to a little school called “Montclair” almost next to the Orpington War Memorial, until the age of 11. At around 10, we discovered the “ruins”. One was a big old house next to the Commodore cinema in the High Street, but the most exciting was the huge underground bomb shelter not far from the Commodore. Even in my day, it was covered over and made into a car park. In the tiled tunnels were still wartime posters, helmets, beds, gas masks and plenty of puddles. For small boys it was exciting and scary!
My mother “forced” us to church in Farnborough - St. Giles - for some years, where the Rector, Aidan Chapman, held an extremely well attended 10am Sunday service. Ex RN (*corrected below), he took a yearly youth group for a week's sailing experience on the Norfolk Broads. From Chelsfield Church, St Martins, across to Holly Road, we could often hear them at bell ringing practice.
The whole district around Green Street Green now looks gentrified, cleaned, greened, modified, built in, on, up, and over - no longer a bit “shabby”, as it perhaps was in the 40s and 50s. Are the many hills even as steep? My brother and I actually cycled all the way up WEL hill, even the really steep bit between Elm and Holly Roads. Going down it was no hands, with a foot on the front wheel as brake. Over the handlebars? - yes – once, lesson learned.
Green Street Green, on the edge of mighty London and the fine Kent countryside could give great scope to kids growing up in that environment. I have never felt inclined to city/town life but at the back of my mind I always had the satisfaction of knowing that I knew both worlds. I’m glad I have good memories of growing up in Holly Road and GSG. It was as good a place as any."
(Sent to GSGA in July 2020)
* 20 Sep 2023: Rector Chapman's daughter, Susan Marshall, corrected this as he was "in the Kent Yeomanry as an Army Chaplain, gaining the Territorial Medal."
"I have lived in Australia and Papua New Guinea since 1963. My memories are boyhood only and that, living where we did, we were betwixt and between Green Street Green (GSG) and Chelsfield. So, my recollections are slightly broader ranging rather than GSG specifically.
I was born in June 1942, in a house named “Braemar”, in Tubbenden Lane, near Orpington Station. Six months later, our family moved to Holly Cottage, Holly Road in Green Street Green. We remained there until I was 19. Holly Road then was a solid bog in winter and a grassland in summer. Many times I winter we got tuck in gluey ruts in our old Singer car. There was only gaslight and no phone nor electricity until much later. There were only three houses in the road and we had nearly an acre of garden, with wonderful open countryside across the fence and the A21 valley to Norstead Manor.
We thought the GSG farmer who farmed the fields outside our garden was named Mr Holly. Perhaps someone can confirm that, as I would be interested in knowing what it really was. His Guernsey dairy cows grazed over the fence. I remember his farm men spreading muck from horse carts, hand sowing wheat seed, the old threshing machine and gang, straw ricks and even, once, a gang hand tedding and raking the hay. All in the field over the garden fence were the final throws of the old farming systems. Even at this young age, they always let me help. And I did with all those jobs. (I followed agriculture in later life). We understood that the fence at the end of the “tree” roads right down to GSG was the London Green Belt boundary but I see from Google that our old garden has been extended out into that field.
Also, from that field, we could see the fighter planes land/take off at Biggin Hill. Then the first of the new jets – the Meteors arrived. The world was about to change. At the end of Holly Road an air raid siren stood for some years. Evidently a barrage balloon was also in the field close by. I am told the last doodlebug exploded near Chelsfield. Perhaps that is the one for which I remember being rushed down to our garden air raid shelter. Yet, for all we now know about the 1950s Cold War, it utterly passed us by. Nothing mentioned in school.
At the junction of Holly Road and Worlds End Lane (WEL) was a large house with large chestnut trees and the garden ran almost the entire length of one side of Holly Road. An elderly, cultured couple, Mr & Mrs Saunders, lived here. I believe they were senior members of the Alpine Garden Society. Many times their visitors in large pre-war cars with huge headlights would park outside their house.
Also always parked at this end of Holly Road was the poor old Express Dairies horse, nose bag on, resting after pulling the heavy milk cart all the way from the Orpington depot and all the way up WEL hill. A vision held deep all my life, which has affected my views on animal treatment, is of one of those horses desperately trying to pull that cart around the corner of WEL into Glentrammon Road – very steep here – on Ice! It nearly died from its efforts. Electric carts were a blessing.
Coming out of Holly Road onto WEL, to the right was the more gentrified area of Homestead and Oxenden Wood Roads and the “other” end of the Lane.
Almost opposite, was Julian Road. Mr Wells the builder lived in the first house. I remember the new sewage line being put in right down the centre of this hard, white chalk/flint unmade road - old steam type excavators digging very deep trenches. This was the beginning of post war modernisation. One walk down Julian Road to get to Chelsfield Station, via Windsor Drive. There were no houses in Windsor Drive in those days just wheat fields. Several times, big fires rage through them, lit by embers thrown out of the funnels of speeding steam trains. In the early 50s, I remember waiting for the train to school, about 8.30 am, with the magnificent sight and sound of the Golden Arrow or the French Pullman Overnight Paris to London Express roaring through the station, Pullman table lamps glowing. Now, all trains are doing 100mph..
Windsor Drive then, in snow times, was a magnet for schoolboy tobogganers like me, as was the steep hillside above GSG between Old Hill and the bypass. There were large numbers of lads at these times.
Turning left from Holly was the very steep hill down to GSG and a more mixed population. Three ’tree’ ’roads down, on the corner of Elm Road was Mr Black’s grocery shop, for whom I worked, aged 15, as a Saturday delivery boy, huge loads of grocery orders tottering on the back and front carriers of a very heavy black delivery bike (a la Granville in “Open all Hours”!). I always went up the hill as far as Oxenden and sometimes down the really steep, slippery “Squirrels Path” down to the A21 and along to The Hillside with deliveries. Do kids do this nowadays? I earned 7/6d (37.5p) plus tips! Of course this would go straight back to Mr Black for Wagonwheels (much bigger then) and a bottle of Tizer or Lucozade.
The next road down was Ash. At its corner was the Post Office Shop. I could never work out why GSG PO was right up here. I can’t remember another one right in the village. Along this road lived an eccentric elderly lady, Mrs Cutler. Much caution was shown by small boys from the waving walking stick.
At the next corner down was the Anglican Church and Hall. My mother was a member of the Chelsfield Choral and Orchestral Society. One memorable Christmas, they performed Handel’s ‘’Messiah’’ in the hall. They did well, with a great sound.
A few yards further down, was (and still is) the upper end of the Public Footpath that came up from the village and had a pongy beginning alongside the farm. Next down, were the semidetached farm workers cottages. And so on, down past Vine Road School to the very bottom with the Queen’s Head on one side and 4 shops on the other. The first was the Barber shop, with railings outside, good for kids to somersault on. The last was a real Fish Shop that my mother often went to.
Directly across the main street was an old, narrow, two-storey timber building, to me much in the old Kentish style. It was occupied by a WW veteran with a bad leg (possibly polio), who ran it as a cobblers. A fine smell of leather emanated from the shop. We went there quite often until my father started mending our school shoes himself. They had all leather soles in those days.
Next door was Mrs Tullet’s - what a great sweet and tobacco shop that was. Off the bus from school in Orpington, we ran straight across the road into Mrs Tullet’s for a sherbet or liquorice, something to propel us up that hill, home.
Going to school, we waited at the bus stop under those huge horse chestnut trees opposite The Queen’s Head for the little green 471 bus. They had good conkers in season. Now they are gone since the ‘87 storm. What a pity - they were a village feature.
At the other end of the High Street was Well’s Newsagency, with Wall’s ice cream. Their son was a school mate and would be the same age as I am. Next to it was an ironmongers. How I wish they were still around. The shop men in long brown work coats; paper bags, nails loose and by the penny, hurricane lamps... So much in so small a place. Certainly nothing plastic!
Back toward the Queen’s Head was Mr Dawes’ Bike Shop. My first bike came from there - a beaut maroon BSA. Ah, still I can smell the aroma of a bike shop – Mr Dawes well remembered.
Was there a Co-Op? (The Co-Op in Windsor Drive had one of those overhead wires, spring driven money pots crisscrossing the shop.) I do remember the butcher and watching the huge heavy sides of beef, covered in white cheese cloth, being unloaded and carried over the shoulder into the shop. There was always clean sawdust on the floors. A greengrocer and an off-licence were in that shop row, too (and were still there in the 90s but not now). The rest is hazy.
Opposite Well’s was the old Brewery. In memory I always thought of it as a Morphy Richards place during my years. Or was it a Telephone company? (It was Telcon Plastics from before WWII until 1970/80s). Round towards Farnborough Hill was an old complex of buildings that the Circus used. But also, a Motor Mechanic. My parents took their old Singer car there a few times. (It has been a bus garage for many years now).
In the junction between Farnborough Hill and the by-pass was Brodies Garage and Coaches. Their son Ian went to our school. I believe this business was later bought by the Lewis family. They moved into a house opposite ours in Holly Road, mid 50s.
Strong in the village then was TocH, instigators, I think, of your present Village Centre building? (Indeed they were!) Dad was a member and I remember Mr Ivan Taylor of Oak Road, Dr Forster of Glentrammon Road and another gentleman who was a retired teacher and lived at the farm end of the village main street.
The identity my mother always ensured we raised our school caps to, was Nurse Carriage, the Midwife (was that her correct name?). I’m not sure if she attended my, or my brother’s home birth, but my mother had some respect for her. She would always be with her bike and in uniform, up and down WEL hill. The energy and dedication she showed - I think she had a car in later times.
The double decker, red, London Transport no.51 buses used to terminate in GSG at this end of the village, in an area next to the roundabout between the main street and the by-pass, where we’d collect the bus numbers, across from the Royal Oak. This pub leaned toward the more well-heeled, sports car group. Nearby, the bottom of Old Hill was an old Roman road – a schoolboy myth?
Also, then, the LT Greenline long distance, both single and double decker green buses came through GSG. They came down through Bromley I think and went through to Tonbridge. It was quite exciting to ride on them – “express”! I never did get to do the Orpington Station, GSG, Cudham, Knockholt full round trip on the little green 471 buses. These iconic little buses were made especially for London Transport’s more outlying country lane routes. This one was based in their Dunton Green garage. Cudham is still a mystery to me. Now, I believe you have many buses going everywhere.
A mile or so along the A21 towards Pratts Bottom, down below Holly Road, the Orpington Council garbage trucks would tip the refuse into what must have been old road making gravel pits on the Cudham side of the A21 What an archaeological dig it would make! A big mystery to me still, always interested in geography, is that GSG lies in a valley, often high sided, that runs all the way from Badgers Mount to Orpington. Yet there is no sign of a watercourse or stream or of piping under the roads to take away heavy rain water. Where DOES it all go? In the booklet “The History of GSG” no mention is made. Perhaps it filled the old village pond, now the roundabout. Where also, did the old Brewery water come from?
In one of the woods towards Pratts Bottom is a chalk cave. We boys always called it a “Highwayman’s hideout” but what was it?
The only way between GSG and Chelsfield was either up and along the steep Worlds End Lane and then Church Lane or, back to Warren Road. An even longer route. I do not think that Vine Road and Windsor Drive were really connected when I was a boy. If so, it was rugged. Mostly it was rough and flinty. Glentrammon Road was a shocker and Woodlands Road a bog and rutted. So, I don’t think GSG people made much use of Chelsfield Station. GSG being in a valley, the only way to get anywhere was UP! Holly Road, being mid-way, we used the station quite a lot.
Several times, we caught the train to Dunton Green and then changed to the little branch line that took us to General Wolfe’s village of Westerham. Then we took Public Footpath walks towards Ide Hill, Chartwell and so on, through beautiful north Kent countryside. Returning from one of those trips through Polhill Tunnel, I am still convinced that I saw lights and men in an offshoot tunnel. A “secret” war time tunnel going under to the Halstead Research complex - Fort Halstead?
Also, in the 50s, through GSG in summer time, came great “herds” of cyclists. All coming out of London to spend the weekends in the Kent countryside and even as far as the coast. Returning, they had huge blue bunches of bluebells strapped and wilting on the backs of their bikes. I remember big groups of riders outside the pubs, cafes – and Mr Dawes’ bike shop!
Later in the 50s, when modern motor bikes became prevalent, large groups of lads came through GSG on their new shiny, swept back wind shielded machines. The old push bike had had its day. Most of these motor bike brand names now are also in memory only.
GSG was a bit fortunate to have the by-pass. En masse car trips really took off in the 50s summer times. The constant roar of them returning back to London on a Sunday evening would carry up to us in Holly Road from the A21 below. Many of the cars in those days would break down from overheating. after the slow crawl up Polhill and especially Riverhill. The old cars would be dotted along the A21, bonnets up, steam escaping.
Towards Orpington, before Warren Road, was a hillside of shrubby hawthorns and so on - several acres, in the middle of which was the “Scout Hut” where, for a short time I went to Cubs. There was a large, unused, concrete swimming pool where you could catch newts. What was this place? A pre-war sports club? An Army unit? Now, I think it is part of Osbourne Avenue and is completely covered in housing. When a boy, it was quite a wild area.
I went to a little school called “Montclair” almost next to the Orpington War Memorial, until the age of 11. At around 10, we discovered the “ruins”. One was a big old house next to the Commodore cinema in the High Street, but the most exciting was the huge underground bomb shelter not far from the Commodore. Even in my day, it was covered over and made into a car park. In the tiled tunnels were still wartime posters, helmets, beds, gas masks and plenty of puddles. For small boys it was exciting and scary!
My mother “forced” us to church in Farnborough - St. Giles - for some years, where the Rector, Aidan Chapman, held an extremely well attended 10am Sunday service. Ex RN (*corrected below), he took a yearly youth group for a week's sailing experience on the Norfolk Broads. From Chelsfield Church, St Martins, across to Holly Road, we could often hear them at bell ringing practice.
The whole district around Green Street Green now looks gentrified, cleaned, greened, modified, built in, on, up, and over - no longer a bit “shabby”, as it perhaps was in the 40s and 50s. Are the many hills even as steep? My brother and I actually cycled all the way up WEL hill, even the really steep bit between Elm and Holly Roads. Going down it was no hands, with a foot on the front wheel as brake. Over the handlebars? - yes – once, lesson learned.
Green Street Green, on the edge of mighty London and the fine Kent countryside could give great scope to kids growing up in that environment. I have never felt inclined to city/town life but at the back of my mind I always had the satisfaction of knowing that I knew both worlds. I’m glad I have good memories of growing up in Holly Road and GSG. It was as good a place as any."
(Sent to GSGA in July 2020)
* 20 Sep 2023: Rector Chapman's daughter, Susan Marshall, corrected this as he was "in the Kent Yeomanry as an Army Chaplain, gaining the Territorial Medal."
Eleanor Marx Aveling - the daughter of Karl Marx lived in Green Street Green in 1895 (Wikipedia mentions her as a 'Notable resident'). Where did she live?
(Articles include references to her location being GSG in Aug & Nov 1895)
Click on image to enlarge
Seven Dwarfs sweet shop at 43 High Street
"My mum owned and ran the Sweet shop, Seven Dwarfs. My brother and I lived there until 1958, when we left to go and live with our Dad in Lowestoft, Suffolk. Not sure how long our Mum continued to live in the shop after my parents separated.
We used to sell Elderado icecream, and my Dad made a stall so the icecream could be sold on lovely Summer days in front of the shop on the wide pavement.
Not sure why Mum called it the 7 dwarfs, but in the shop window she had models of all of the dwarfs.
Believe the shop, before it became a confectioners, may have been a fish and chip shop, but not 100% sure of this."
Pat Handley (daughter of the owners, Mr & Mrs Handley)
"My mum owned and ran the Sweet shop, Seven Dwarfs. My brother and I lived there until 1958, when we left to go and live with our Dad in Lowestoft, Suffolk. Not sure how long our Mum continued to live in the shop after my parents separated.
We used to sell Elderado icecream, and my Dad made a stall so the icecream could be sold on lovely Summer days in front of the shop on the wide pavement.
Not sure why Mum called it the 7 dwarfs, but in the shop window she had models of all of the dwarfs.
Believe the shop, before it became a confectioners, may have been a fish and chip shop, but not 100% sure of this."
Pat Handley (daughter of the owners, Mr & Mrs Handley)
A E Smith, the ironmongers, which was at 15 High Street - owned by Dennis Beagley and Derek Martin from the 1960s until ?the end of the century?. They also built many gates, doors and structures throughout the village including, many moons ago, the Greenwood Community Centre. Dennis Beagley died at the end of 2013.
Contributed by Ron Beagley (son of Dennis)
Contributed by Ron Beagley (son of Dennis)
More reminiscences from Roy Beagley about the High Street in the 1950s and 1960s:
(See Local Businesses now)
17 High Street was called My Fair Lady a hairdressers owned by a lady called Mrs Constable. She also owned the hairdressers at 39 High Street. Mrs Constable sold My Fair Lady to my father and mother, and sold number 39 to a guy called Richard.
19 High Street used to be Wells' Newsagent. Run by Maime and Togy Wells (with Togy's brother marking up the paper's on Sunday morning.) One of the people who used to work in the shop was Ted Bray who used to be the caretaker at Vine Road School and also bartender at the Rose and Crown (as indeed was I, bartender, not caretaker!)
21 High Street back in the late 50s and early 60s used to be a chemist called Gibson's.
23 High Street was a cafe back in the late 50s.
25 was Roy Harris's Motorcycle shop, he later also moved in to 27 as well, operating both at the same time. I believe, but am not sure, one of Roy's daughters, Susan, married someone called Chris who started a key cutting shop on the premises, but I am not certain of that. Jean Harris also ran the shop with Roy and both Roy and Jean an my parents, Dennis and Vera used to walk down to the Buff Orpington on a summer's evening and have drinks, whilst us kids would play outside with the occasion lemonade and packet of crisps thrown at us when we got too loud.
27 used to be a greengrocer, I believe, until it was purchased by Roy Harris
31 was a draper's shop called Carol, owned by Vera Beagley, my mother. She used to present fashion shows at Vine Road school and other schools in the area. She operated this store until she died back in 1977. The fashion shows were always interesting as the models (customers of the shop) had quite a few bottles of win in the changing areas at the various show and I think it is fair to say the walks down the catwalk for more and more unsteady as the evenings went on.
33 back in the 50s used to be Cobbler's well known in the area for shoe repairs. The cobbler used to be called Jack, although I don't think anyone really knew Jack's real name. It later became a greengrocers, one of three in the village and the owners of this eventually turned it into a video rental shop. Bev and Trev were the owners, and they left to run a pub down in Whitstable.
35 belonged to Gurneys and used to sell electrical goods such as televisions and radio etc.
37 was a bicycle shop owned by a Mr. Dawes. He seemed quite old when we were kids, but would always let you ride the bikes in the store, many of which were hung from the ceiling.
39 was a hairdressers.
41 was Arthur Gasson's grocers store, where he and Albert used to work. Albert was a very tall man who used to ride around Green Street Green on a pushbike delivering groceries. His sure was a Mace store, the post office further down the road sold Wavy Line products.
43 was a confectioner's store called the Seven Dwarfs. (See reminiscence above from Pat Handley)
45 belonged to a plumber, called Jim Smallwood. Smallwood's was the name of the store.
47 was a baker, called Stanley Wood.
49 was the post office and general stores.
51 was an off licence called Coopers.
59 used to be a greengrocer, but I cannot remember the name. They were famous for boiling beetroots and the people in the council houses opposite (diagonally) used to complain about the smell.
What is now Waitrose car park used to be a petrol station and, before that, a coach company called Timpson's used to be on the site. They would run tours down to the coast in the summer and up to London etc as well as hiring the coaches out. Opposite numbers 15,17 and 19 used to be a factory called Telcon Plastics, although I believe there is a housing estate there now.
(See Local Businesses now)
17 High Street was called My Fair Lady a hairdressers owned by a lady called Mrs Constable. She also owned the hairdressers at 39 High Street. Mrs Constable sold My Fair Lady to my father and mother, and sold number 39 to a guy called Richard.
19 High Street used to be Wells' Newsagent. Run by Maime and Togy Wells (with Togy's brother marking up the paper's on Sunday morning.) One of the people who used to work in the shop was Ted Bray who used to be the caretaker at Vine Road School and also bartender at the Rose and Crown (as indeed was I, bartender, not caretaker!)
21 High Street back in the late 50s and early 60s used to be a chemist called Gibson's.
23 High Street was a cafe back in the late 50s.
25 was Roy Harris's Motorcycle shop, he later also moved in to 27 as well, operating both at the same time. I believe, but am not sure, one of Roy's daughters, Susan, married someone called Chris who started a key cutting shop on the premises, but I am not certain of that. Jean Harris also ran the shop with Roy and both Roy and Jean an my parents, Dennis and Vera used to walk down to the Buff Orpington on a summer's evening and have drinks, whilst us kids would play outside with the occasion lemonade and packet of crisps thrown at us when we got too loud.
27 used to be a greengrocer, I believe, until it was purchased by Roy Harris
31 was a draper's shop called Carol, owned by Vera Beagley, my mother. She used to present fashion shows at Vine Road school and other schools in the area. She operated this store until she died back in 1977. The fashion shows were always interesting as the models (customers of the shop) had quite a few bottles of win in the changing areas at the various show and I think it is fair to say the walks down the catwalk for more and more unsteady as the evenings went on.
33 back in the 50s used to be Cobbler's well known in the area for shoe repairs. The cobbler used to be called Jack, although I don't think anyone really knew Jack's real name. It later became a greengrocers, one of three in the village and the owners of this eventually turned it into a video rental shop. Bev and Trev were the owners, and they left to run a pub down in Whitstable.
35 belonged to Gurneys and used to sell electrical goods such as televisions and radio etc.
37 was a bicycle shop owned by a Mr. Dawes. He seemed quite old when we were kids, but would always let you ride the bikes in the store, many of which were hung from the ceiling.
39 was a hairdressers.
41 was Arthur Gasson's grocers store, where he and Albert used to work. Albert was a very tall man who used to ride around Green Street Green on a pushbike delivering groceries. His sure was a Mace store, the post office further down the road sold Wavy Line products.
43 was a confectioner's store called the Seven Dwarfs. (See reminiscence above from Pat Handley)
45 belonged to a plumber, called Jim Smallwood. Smallwood's was the name of the store.
47 was a baker, called Stanley Wood.
49 was the post office and general stores.
51 was an off licence called Coopers.
59 used to be a greengrocer, but I cannot remember the name. They were famous for boiling beetroots and the people in the council houses opposite (diagonally) used to complain about the smell.
What is now Waitrose car park used to be a petrol station and, before that, a coach company called Timpson's used to be on the site. They would run tours down to the coast in the summer and up to London etc as well as hiring the coaches out. Opposite numbers 15,17 and 19 used to be a factory called Telcon Plastics, although I believe there is a housing estate there now.
Nigel Box worked at Telcon Plastics in 1973 and lived in the Green until 1981
21 was Ray Barnards betting shop he also had car lot at 37a. Roy and Jean Harris bought it later and ran a key cutting shop there until it was sold to Dr Barker for the new surgery.
23 was a Launderette owned by Mr Rupp
25 was F&J Harris Motorcycles
27 became their car accessory shop run by their daughter Christine.
29 was Food Trade Press. Mr Binstead (now Express Key & Lock Service)
31 was Carols Fashions, then later F&J Harris car Accessories, then Express Keys. Now a pet shop
33 was Rowes Greengrocers, Bev and Brian.
35-37 was Ken Birds Cycles
37a was the car lot.
39 was (probably) Richards Hair
21 was Ray Barnards betting shop he also had car lot at 37a. Roy and Jean Harris bought it later and ran a key cutting shop there until it was sold to Dr Barker for the new surgery.
23 was a Launderette owned by Mr Rupp
25 was F&J Harris Motorcycles
27 became their car accessory shop run by their daughter Christine.
29 was Food Trade Press. Mr Binstead (now Express Key & Lock Service)
31 was Carols Fashions, then later F&J Harris car Accessories, then Express Keys. Now a pet shop
33 was Rowes Greengrocers, Bev and Brian.
35-37 was Ken Birds Cycles
37a was the car lot.
39 was (probably) Richards Hair
Tony Boulind, who grew up in GSG in the 50s and 60s, has offered the following reminiscences:
- It wasn't Timpson's Coaches, it was Lewis's Coaches. Then it became a petrol station (Jet?). *
- Stanley's Nursery (gardening not children) was next door, long before Lloyd's Bank & Waitrose.
- Telcon Plastics was formerly Fox's Brewery. Some travelling funfair proprietors used to store their rides on the property during the winter months.
- Brittenden Close was named after a local architect. There was a Mrs Brittenden (widow?) who lived at "Pinchbeck" in Glentrammon Road. Her house was demolished to make way for Pinchbeck Road.
- Laxey & Lezayre Roads both take their names from places in the Isle of Man, but Trammon is in Ireland. Maybe somebody knows why their names have cropped up in Green Street Green. As an aside, grandmother always asserted that "Chelsfield" was a contraction of "Chilly Fields".
- At the southern end of the High Street, before the Royal Oak, there was an annex to Vine Road primary school, which catered for the youngest infants. Was the teacher Mrs Startup?
- Almost next door was a small sweet shop run by Mrs Tullett.
Green Street Green Association (CIO) is a registered charity no.1172661 Company no: CE010104